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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Has anyone contacted the pistol bureau to hear how they are going to change given the proper cause requirement was deemed unconstitutional?

New York’s proper-cause requirement violates the Fourteenth Amendment in that it prevents law-abiding citizens with ordinary self-defense needs from exercising their right to keep and bear arms. We therefore reverse the judgment of the Court of Appeals and remand the case for further proceedings consistent with this opinion.
 

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Has anyone contacted the pistol bureau to hear how they are going to change given the proper cause requirement was deemed unconstitutional?

New York’s proper-cause requirement violates the Fourteenth Amendment in that it prevents law-abiding citizens with ordinary self-defense needs from exercising their right to keep and bear arms. We therefore reverse the judgment of the Court of Appeals and remand the case for further proceedings consistent with this opinion.
Was wondering the same thing
 

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I am hearing good news. Those restrictions are gone!
I actually called the pistol bureau after I made that comment, the lady said they will fully comply with the ruling and there were “people” upstairs discussing how to implement the ruling. She was nice, sounded stressed because I’m sure tons of people called there today asking the same thing
 

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I actually called the pistol bureau after I made that comment, the lady said they will fully comply with the ruling and there were “people” upstairs discussing how to implement the ruling. She was nice, sounded stressed because I’m sure tons of people called there today asking the same thing
Which county did you call and speak with?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I emailed the state police and this is what i got back.
From: troopers.sm.h.pistol.permit <[email protected]>
Date: Thu, Jun 23, 2022 at 3:42 PM




New York State Pistol Permits are issued by the County you reside in or the New York City Police Department if you reside within New York City. I recommend you contact the Pistol Permit Licensing Authority in your jurisdiction. Each Jurisdiction may interpret the Supreme Court decision differently. Each jurisdiction may take different steps to implement permit application procedures.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I did call NCPD and they said they don’t have any revised guidance, and they will send information to license holders when they do. In the meantime all restrictions apply. I’d be interested to hear from a lawyer about when the Supreme Court case becomes effective. When I read the case it directs the lower court to update the opinion but I am not sure how that works or if it just nullifies proper cause overall.
 

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I think people are confusing the ruling. The lower court must revise the opinion based on the guidance of the SCOTUS. However, the law of the land as of yesterday is that the requirement that an applicant show “proper cause” in order to obtain a CCW is NOW unconstitutional.

Folks trying to delay action keep saying that they have to wait for the lower court to revise the previous ruling, however, said fact does not permit a licensing authority to continue to engage in unconstitutional behavior.
 

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Folks:
SASI has sent written requests, directly, to the Suffolk County Police Commissioner and Sheriff, asking each to provide a written expression of what their respective departments will be doing, in response to the Bruen decision. We will post each of their responses, here and on our website, as they are received.
Gary
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Folks:
SASI has sent written requests, directly, to the Suffolk County Police Commissioner and Sheriff, asking each to provide a written expression of what their respective departments will be doing, in response to the Bruen decision. We will post each of their responses, here and on our website, as they are received.
Gary
Can you send it to NCPD as well? I am wondering if someone tries to change their type of permit restrictions to a full carry if that will be a forcing function?
 

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Can you send it to NCPD as well? I am wondering if someone tries to change their type of permit restrictions to a full carry if that will be a forcing function?
I think you have it backwards. My understanding is the Supreme Court decision nullified the restrictions. I don't see the issue as being a license holder needing to requesting a change but rather the licensing agent conforming to the change that has already taken place.
 
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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
My view is I think the licensing officers will take the position that restrictions apply unless you convert your license. They will drag their feet more than a 3 year old leaving a candy store for every step. If they just delete the clause in the handbook as a first step for full carry they can revoke your license, at their discretion, for carrying outside of the restrictions, and then you need to fight to get it back. The ruling didn’t nullify permits, just the criteria used to get a full carry permit. I’d be interested to see if a local law firm has any guidance. In the NCPD handbook there is a section on changing the permit type. It says you need to contact the department for the forms.
 

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My view is I think the licensing officers will take the position that restrictions apply unless you convert your license. They will drag their feet more than a 3 year old leaving a candy store for every step. If they just delete the clause in the handbook as a first step for full Cary they can remove your license at their discretion still carrying outside of the restrictions, and then you need to fight to get it back. The ruling didn’t nullify permits, just the criteria used to get a full carry permit. I’d be interested to see if a local law firm has any guidance. In the NCPD permit their is a section on changing the permit type. It says you need to contact the department for the forms.
It is up to the Licensing jurisdiction, most likely for legal purposes that an amendment is necessary to remove the administrative restrictions.
 

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Can you send it to NCPD as well? I am wondering if someone tries to change their type of permit restrictions to a full carry if that will be a forcing function?
That's a good question. I wonder what NCPD will do if someone did now apply to remove their restrictions. Let's be fair to the Pistol Bureaus for now. This decision only came out the other day. Every county is probably having meetings on this and I dare say, awaiting guidance from the State. They have to in order to update their handbooks. We have no idea what will be "sensitive places" or whatnot.

Pending legislative initiatives will be affecting a lot of people who currently have unrestricted licenses and even business carry licenses. Hochul mentioned that she wants a law that presumes that a private business forbids guns unless they have signage saying otherwise. Imagine being a current business carry licensee and you can't even buy coffee or take a lunch. She and her comrades will be affecting a lot of decent, law abiding people who did the right thing and keep this State going.
 

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I think people are confusing the ruling. The lower court must revise the opinion based on the guidance of the SCOTUS. However, the law of the land as of yesterday is that the requirement that an applicant show “proper cause” in order to obtain a CCW is NOW unconstitutional.

Folks trying to delay action keep saying that they have to wait for the lower court to revise the previous ruling, however, said fact does not permit a licensing authority to continue to engage in unconstitutional behavior.
The SCOTUS didn't just hand down the new standard to be applied, they issued an opinion that speaks to very specific language in a very specific statute, there is no ambiguity about what portion of what law is unconstitutional and no longer (and never was) valid law. They're not acting because they will give you rights as an absolute last resort.
 

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That's a good question. I wonder what NCPD will do if someone did now apply to remove their restrictions. Let's be fair to the Pistol Bureaus for now. This decision only came out the other day. Every county is probably having meetings on this and I dare say, awaiting guidance from the State. They have to in order to update their handbooks. We have no idea what will be "sensitive places" or whatnot.

Pending legislative initiatives will be affecting a lot of people who currently have unrestricted licenses and even business carry licenses. Hochul mentioned that she wants a law that presumes that a private business forbids guns unless they have signage saying otherwise. Imagine being a current business carry licensee and you can't even buy coffee or take a lunch. She and her comrades will be affecting a lot of decent, law abiding people who did the right thing and keep this State going.
Let's be fair, everyone knew this was coming. They were, at best, willfully ignorant, but more than likely didn't come up with a plan because they don't care about you or your rights.

New Jersey has already suspended their 'proper cause' restrictions - the 2nd Circuit has zero authority over the State of New Jersey. New Jersey isn't waiting, why is New York?
 

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My view is I think the licensing officers will take the position that restrictions apply unless you convert your license. They will drag their feet more than a 3 year old leaving a candy store for every step. If they just delete the clause in the handbook as a first step for full carry they can revoke your license, at their discretion, for carrying outside of the restrictions, and then you need to fight to get it back. The ruling didn’t nullify permits, just the criteria used to get a full carry permit. I’d be interested to see if a local law firm has any guidance. In the NCPD handbook there is a section on changing the permit type. It says you need to contact the department for the forms.
Send a certified letter with a check for their usual amendment fee and demand an upgrade. Let them explain in writing why they want to continue to rely on an unconstitutional law. If they force everyone to apply for an upgrade, it will take them YEARS to finish that process, it's just not feasible. Their only valid course of action is to convert everyone automatically.
 

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My view is I think the licensing officers will take the position that restrictions apply unless you convert your license. They will drag their feet more than a 3 year old leaving a candy store for every step. If they just delete the clause in the handbook as a first step for full carry they can revoke your license, at their discretion, for carrying outside of the restrictions, and then you need to fight to get it back. The ruling didn’t nullify permits, just the criteria used to get a full carry permit. I’d be interested to see if a local law firm has any guidance. In the NCPD handbook there is a section on changing the permit type. It says you need to contact the department for the forms.
The restrictions are an illegal infringement on your right to carry a firearm in public for self-defense. The Supreme Court didn't leave the licensing authority an option. You either have a license to keep and bear arms or you don't. The license according to PL 400 is an f class, concealed carry license. The administrative restrictions are null and void.
 
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