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"whoops i killed you" = 1 year
"whoops i shot myself in the leg" = 2 years

How does this make sense ? :crazy

http://www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/06/12/california.subway.shooting.release/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

"Los Angeles (CNN) -- A former transit police officer convicted last year in the shooting death of an unarmed man on an Oakland, California, train platform will be freed from prison early Monday morning, according to a court order.

Johannes Mehserle was sentenced to two years in prison for the involuntary manslaughter conviction, but California law gives him one day of good conduct credit for each of the 365 days he's already served behind bars, Los Angeles Superior Court Judge Robert Perry said in an order signed Friday.

Mehserle, a Bay Area Rapid Transit police officer when the shooting occurred, said at the trial that he intended to draw and fire his Taser rather than his gun when he fatally wounded 22-year-old Oscar Grant on New Years Day 2009.

Mehserle, who has been behind bars since a Los Angeles jury found him guilty on July 8, 2010, will be free to walk out of prison just after midnight Sunday, Perry said.

Violent protests erupted in Oakland last November when Perry sentenced Mehserle to just two years in prison, which meant he would possibly be released after another seven months.

At least 150 people were arrested during the protests, which Oakland Police Chief Anthony Batts described at the time as "tearing up the city."

Grant's mother, Wanda Johnson, had asked the judge to sentence Mehserle to the maximum 14 years in prison. She and four other family members who spoke at the sentencing hearing last year called him "a murderer."

The jury acquitted him of the more serious charges of second-degree murder and voluntary manslaughter.

Although his defense attorney argued for probation, Mehserle told Perry before sentencing that he would be willing to go to prison if the sentence made his city and family safer.

"I shot a man," he said. "I killed a man. It should not have happened."

A conviction for involuntary manslaughter normally carries a four-year sentence, but the judge had the option of adding an "enhancement" that could have made the sentence 14 years because a firearm was used in commission of a crime."
 

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This was the incident that was caught on cell phone cameras. If you have ever seen the videos, it looks like an execution of a man already down on his belly and in cuffs.

Illinois doesn't want to have this problem so they have just made filming a police officer the same punishment as rape. That way, if this were to happen in Illinois, the cop could get 2 years and be out in one but the person that filmed the cop doing it would get 15 years.
 

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What a nightmare this was.

Hypothetical question:
If part of your job was driving a truck and at a red light you accidentally hit the gas pedal instead of the brake. Your truck lurches forward and runs over a person that is jaywalking. Should you go to jail? It was an accident. You were negligent, but you did not intentionally run over this person. But, even after 2 weeks of driver training when you started your job and maybe a one-day refresher/road test each year, you still screwed-up and ran over someone and killed someone. Prison??? 1 year? 2 years? 14 years?

Is the above scenario much different from what happened to the BART cop? From what I remember of the video, the deceased was under arrest and fighting the cops. While on the gournd and still fighting, a BART cop shot him in front of ten's of commuters and he died. The cop said he thought he was using his Taser but drew his firearm instead. The court ruled that the officer did not intentionally shoot this person with a firearm.

After raising their right hand and swearing in to the NYPD, the Commanding Officer got up and said to the 2800 new recruits, "Congratulations, you've never been so close to going to prison than right now." True story. He then explained how split-second decisions can make you a hero, dead or in prison.
 

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just working to improve,one round at a time
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Dan. Your sooooo right.

While this was a shame and under stress one could see this going down NYPD won't let street cops use tazers (you can OC sprayanuse your asp,then shoot them, but tazeing could get ugly fast.
PS. Sue happy NY has NYPD cops standing over guns foiund on the street(even revolvers) till EMS shows up to make it safe. ( A rooky I know in manhattan soith had to sytangh ovet a revolver for 4 hrs till EMS came by to pick it up.
 

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Dan 0351 said:
What a nightmare this was.

Hypothetical question:
If part of your job was driving a truck and at a red light you accidentally hit the gas pedal instead of the brake. Your truck lurches forward and runs over a person that is jaywalking. Should you go to jail? It was an accident. You were negligent, but you did not intentionally run over this person. But, even after 2 weeks of driver training when you started your job and maybe a one-day refresher/road test each year, you still screwed-up and ran over someone and killed someone. Prison??? 1 year? 2 years? 14 years?

Is the above scenario much different from what happened to the BART cop? From what I remember of the video, the deceased was under arrest and fighting the cops. While on the gournd and still fighting, a BART cop shot him in front of ten's of commuters and he died. The cop said he thought he was using his Taser but drew his firearm instead. The court ruled that the officer did not intentionally shoot this person with a firearm.

After raising their right hand and swearing in to the NYPD, the Commanding Officer got up and said to the 2800 new recruits, "Congratulations, you've never been so close to going to prison than right now." True story. He then explained how split-second decisions can make you a hero, dead or in prison.
The analogy appears to be a poor one. If the jay walker steps out between two cars before the truck driver can stop then it's largely his own fault. If Mr. Grant had walked onto a pistol range and got shot it would be a good analogy.

Go watch the videos of the shooting.

Now, if we believe the shooter's version of events, a better analogy would be "I was backing my truck up to the loading docks. Everybody said use "bay 2", but I somehow backed into "bay 4" and didn't notice it was the wrong bay, or somebody was standing in front of it. I really didn't mean to run over the guy who'd been pissing me off".
 

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Assault is a behavior; Not a weapon.
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hydtguy said:
Dan. Your sooooo right.

While this was a shame and under stress one could see this going down NYPD won't let street cops use tazers (you can OC sprayanuse your asp,then shoot them, but tazeing could get ugly fast.
PS. Sue happy NY has NYPD cops standing over guns foiund on the street(even revolvers) till EMS shows up to make it safe. ( A rooky I know in manhattan soith had to sytangh ovet a revolver for 4 hrs till EMS came by to pick it up.
I have a nephew on the job. We were at the range one day, and I offered to let him shoot my old NYPD back-up revolver. He didn't know how to load ot unload the gun or how to make it safe. (As an Uncle, it was quite an embarassing day). That's when I decided to buy one of each, just so he'd be safer in the streets.

Yeah Honey ... That's really the reason! 8)

But it really is.
 

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Lemming said:
The analogy appears to be a poor one. If the jay walker steps out between two cars before the truck driver can stop then it's largely his own fault. If Mr. Grant had walked onto a pistol range and got shot it would be a good analogy.

Go watch the videos of the shooting.

Now, if we believe the shooter's version of events, a better analogy would be "I was backing my truck up to the loading docks. Everybody said use "bay 2", but I somehow backed into "bay 4" and didn't notice it was the wrong bay, or somebody was standing in front of it. I really didn't mean to run over the guy who'd been pissing me off".
So the cop backed over some guy in the train station at a red light? Thats bad
 
G

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hydtguy said:
Dan. Your sooooo right.

While this was a shame and under stress one could see this going down NYPD won't let street cops use tazers (you can OC sprayanuse your asp,then shoot them, but tazeing could get ugly fast.
PS. Sue happy NY has NYPD cops standing over guns foiund on the street(even revolvers) till EMS shows up to make it safe. ( A rooky I know in manhattan soith had to sytangh ovet a revolver for 4 hrs till EMS came by to pick it up.
Ever since the "stun gun" scandal in the 106 anything that "zaps" someone is basically never going to happen in NY.
A taser probably is considered a firearm anyway, since it fires a projectile using gunpowder (I think).
 

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He shouldn't have done a single day.

Threads like these make me sad. It the perp had just followed the law, complied with the police, etc. It never would have happened.
 

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OH UNCLE PAUL said:
He shouldn't have done a single day.

Threads like these make me sad. It the perp had just followed the law, complied with the police, etc. It never would have happened.
Wow, really. The "perp" is handcuffed and pinned to the ground, and so it's still okay to shoot him in the back?
 

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Assault is a behavior; Not a weapon.
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If the perp had been a law abiding citizen, he wouldn't have been a perp. The perp has got to accept some responsibility for his actions.

Like they say ... Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
 

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T.Webb said:
If the perp had been a law abiding citizen, he wouldn't have been a perp. The perp has got to accept some responsibility for his actions.

Like they say ... Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Really? I mean, if Grant had gotten some bruises and a limp for resisting arrest I'd say "stupid prizes". If he got tazed before he got cuffed. . . "stupid prizes".

Cuffed, pinned and then shot by a cop whose story is "oops, I thought it was my Taser"? If even the cop says he had no reason to kill Grant then this is _way_ beyond stupid prizes.
 

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Clinger
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Lemming said:
Really? I mean, if Grant had gotten some bruises and a limp for resisting arrest I'd say "stupid prizes". If he got tazed before he got cuffed. . . "stupid prizes".

Cuffed, pinned and then shot by a cop whose story is "oops, I thought it was my Taser"? If even the cop says he had no reason to kill Grant then this is _way_ beyond stupid prizes.
But they did have a trial they presented evidence and witnesses ,video , he was convicted, did the time he was sentenced to do ... and now we are debating what? It's done the system worked, What is the problem ?
 

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crashguy said:
But they did have a trial they presented evidence and witnesses ,video , he was convicted, did the time he was sentenced to do ... and now we are debating what? It's done the system worked, What is the problem ?
VERY TRUE. A Cali jury saw all the evidence, weighed all the options, viewed it all with a open mind, AND LET OJ GO FREE!!
 

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OH UNCLE PAUL said:
He shouldn't have done a single day.

Threads like these make me sad. It the perp had just followed the law, complied with the police, etc. It never would have happened.
LOL, precious...
 

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OH UNCLE PAUL said:
VERY TRUE. A Cali jury saw all the evidence, weighed all the options, viewed it all with a open mind, AND LET OJ GO FREE!!
Open mind? that I don't know , the dicussion of whether OJ did it or not is over as well, the people have spoken. So like I said , the guy took his sentence, did his time, now it's over. This case is being dicussed as if it just happened when in fact it's done. Like it or not .
 

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Lemming said:
The analogy appears to be a poor one. If the jay walker steps out between two cars before the truck driver can stop then it's largely his own fault. If Mr. Grant had walked onto a pistol range and got shot it would be a good analogy.

Go watch the videos of the shooting.

Now, if we believe the shooter's version of events, a better analogy would be "I was backing my truck up to the loading docks. Everybody said use "bay 2", but I somehow backed into "bay 4" and didn't notice it was the wrong bay, or somebody was standing in front of it. I really didn't mean to run over the guy who'd been pissing me off".
I see nothing wrong with discussing an 'old' or 'finished' case. And Lemming, sorry, but I don't agree. I like my analogy better. The BART cop shot the perpetrator ACCIDENTALLY. Yes, the perp deserved to go to jail for the night, not die, but that's not the issue. It was an accident, unless anyone can prove otherwise (I have no doubt that there are a few on this site that believe, with no other info, that this cop executed this guy for being disorderly in front of 10's of witnesses). Poor training? Perhaps. A bad cop? Maybe. But criminal? With the limited facts and with my personal experience it doesn't look/sound criminal. It appears that using the Taser in that situation would have been appropriate - in "drive-stun" mode w/ no cartridge. Controling a fighting/resisting arrestee is not personal - as in your analogy. It's all business. BUT, I was not in the trial room and I don't have all the facts of the case.

Another cop out west had a department issued rifle with a light on it. To turn on the light you have to "pull a trigger" with your support hand - similar to the trigger to shoot the weapon. Well, during an "armed assault-in-progress" call in the wee hours of the night he went to shine his light on an (unarmed) combatant and put a .223 soft-point into his chest - by accident. Under stress that few here know about, he pulled the wrong trigger. Should that cop have gone to prison??? In Suffolk Co., NY, during a drug raid, a SWAT cop tripped on a tree root and put a few rounds from his MP5 through the front door, killing someone inside. Jail? Prison?
 

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T.Webb said:
If the perp had been a law abiding citizen, he wouldn't have been a perp. The perp has got to accept some responsibility for his actions.

Like they say ... Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Because everyone that the police cuff and pin to the ground is a perp and none are ever law abiding citizens. Cops never get the wrong guy, make a mistake or get bad intell or reports.
 

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Personally, I think it was an accident based solely on the officer's reaction afterwards. What I think doesn't really matter. He was convicted of involuntary manslaughter because the jury determined that it was an accident and was not guilty of murder.
 
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