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Get the latest facts on the new NY SAFE gun laws that effect you!

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Queens man gets two years in prison for giant arsenal

queens man gets two years in prison for giant arsenal

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45 replies to this topic

#21 firemanvin

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Posted October 06 2016 - 03:28 PM

Maybe a way to look at it is if you have one thing illegal, everything else become illegal. even if the balance of the guns were originally legal. In other words, let's say we own one rifle that is legally classified in NY as an "assault rifle" that is not registered, and we also have 5 legally registered handguns. The fact that we have the illegal AR makes us culpable and implies that we should not legally have the 5 handguns, even though they are legally registered. So, in effect, getting busted with just the one unregistered AR can open the door to charges on 6 illegal firearms possessions. I'm not sure if this logic is correct, but it's something to think about.

Now, of course if your a bona fide criminal, six unregistered guns usually leads to a plea deal of a misdemeanor with a year probation because it's a lot more exciting to throw the book at a good guy with a gun than a bad guy with a gun.

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#22 ProGodProGunProLife

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Posted October 06 2016 - 03:56 PM

Maybe a way to look at it is if you have one thing illegal, everything else become illegal. even if the balance of the guns were originally legal. In other words, let's say we own one rifle that is legally classified in NY as an "assault rifle" that is not registered, and we also have 5 legally registered handguns. The fact that we have the illegal AR makes us culpable and implies that we should not legally have the 5 handguns, even though they are legally registered. So, in effect, getting busted with just the one unregistered AR can open the door to charges on 6 illegal firearms possessions. I'm not sure if this logic is correct, but it's something to think about.

Now, of course if your a bona fide criminal, six unregistered guns usually leads to a plea deal of a misdemeanor with a year probation because it's a lot more exciting to throw the book at a good guy with a gun than a bad guy with a gun.


I don't think that is the case.

From an earlier story, I see that he allegedly had 3, loaded 20 round magazines. and an "assault rifle". He was facing 7 years, if convicted, according to that article. It is also possible he was over some limit for powder weight and they might have tried to make a case from the "unassembled assault rifles".

I think the DA gave the media the whole list of LEGAL stuff he had to make him seem, really, really scary and the arrest like a major bust of a dangerous man with a "huge arsenal"...and only 2 blocks from a school!
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#23 only7rounds

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Posted October 06 2016 - 04:46 PM

I know this is an ongoing debate, but many Police ballistic experts I know, who are certified to testify in court as EXPERTS, say that the box of parts thing is nonsense. If you have all the parts to assemble an "assault weapon" without any gunsmithing being required, it is an "assault weapon".
This is NOT to say that if you have an assembled ARES SCR and also an upper with a threaded barrel, NOT on the gun, it is now illegal. They say that what is on the gun is on the gun, you just can not disassemble it to somehow make it legal. If the gun is not assembled and all the parts are there, they can put it together and testify as an expert that it is an "assault weapon".

#24 viper720

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Posted October 06 2016 - 04:57 PM

Remember folks, assault *weapon*
They want assault rifle and assault weapon to be synonymous to manipulate you.
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#25 Beverly Sheckler

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Posted October 06 2016 - 06:08 PM

Get used to it.


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#26 Short Track Hunter

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Posted October 06 2016 - 06:09 PM

What if all that was in Nassau? Would it be a crime ??

#27 Parashooter

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Posted October 06 2016 - 07:35 PM

Peter:
Fire code, in NYC, is effective law. Also, some of the "parts" he had may have been illegal. Remember, a receiver can be an "assault weapon" and, if not registered, illegal. Also, he seems to have had some other unregistered long guns and unregistered "high cap" mags, from that story.
NYC also requires a gun safe, for more than 5 handguns. That's where they got him, on "unsecured."
What he really had, we may never know. What was illegal, among those guns, also, we may never know.
His attorney may have, also, been a joke.
Gary


You keep saying "fire code is effective" yeah so? - I'll say it again - it has been discussed here, and it seems NYC has a 250 pound limit (I"m not positive, just what I recall...) the accused had LESS than that, so a non-issue.

Please name a receiver that by itself is an "assault weapon" ??

I'm also not arguing whether or not he had magazines or other violations of the law...

And you obviously missed the sarcasm in my "Standby Mode" comment.... (If you had been at the legislature to fight the proposed law, you'd get the joke...)

#28 grifhunter

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Posted October 06 2016 - 11:17 PM

I know this is an ongoing debate, but many Police ballistic experts I know, who are certified to testify in court as EXPERTS, say that the box of parts thing is nonsense. If you have all the parts to assemble an "assault weapon" without any gunsmithing being required, it is an "assault weapon".
This is NOT to say that if you have an assembled ARES SCR and also an upper with a threaded barrel, NOT on the gun, it is now illegal. They say that what is on the gun is on the gun, you just can not disassemble it to somehow make it legal. If the gun is not assembled and all the parts are there, they can put it together and testify as an expert that it is an "assault weapon".


So if one has a 10/22 wearing a traditional wood stock, but also has a pistol gripped replacement stock in a box in the basement he is now in possession of an AW?
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#29 only7rounds

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Posted October 07 2016 - 12:14 AM

So if one has a 10/22 wearing a traditional wood stock, but also has a pistol gripped replacement stock in a box in the basement he is now in possession of an AW?


Read what I wrote.
My information, from very good legal sources, is that as long as the gun is assembled with a legal stock it is legal.
Take the stock off and throw the action into a box with the thumbhole stock and andy wants you to go to prison.
Stupid, I know.

#30 only7rounds

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Posted October 07 2016 - 12:16 AM

Lets put it another way.
Lets say I have a registered AR-15 pre-ban with all the "goodies".
Lets say I also have an ARES SCR.
Both guns are totally legal.
However, if I remove the upper from the AR and put it on the ARES I am a Felon.
As long as the guns are assembled legally they are legal.
Taking a gun apart does not render it into something other than a gun.

#31 ProGodProGunProLife

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Posted October 07 2016 - 06:37 AM

Lets put it another way.
Lets say I have a registered AR-15 pre-ban with all the "goodies".
Lets say I also have an ARES SCR.
Both guns are totally legal.
However, if I remove the upper from the AR and put it on the ARES I am a Felon.
As long as the guns are assembled legally they are legal.
Taking a gun apart does not render it into something other than a gun.


I think you bring up good points, but I don't think there is an authoritative answer as to the legality of possessing different combinations of rifles and rifle parts, that are not attached to each other in a way that would form an illegal "assault weapon".

Obviously, a semi auto with a detachable magazine and one or more evil features is illegal.

After that, there are all types of combinations that could be various shades of grey legally.

a) Two full AR-15 platform rifles. One with a fixed magazine and evil upper, grip and stock. The other with a detachable magazine, and no evil features. Legal? Almost certainly, though they could try to argue that the non-conpliant parts and detachable magazine lower are really an assault weapon, cleverly stored disguised as 2 compliant rifles. That would seem like a huge stretch, of course.

B) What about the same 2 rifles, with the uppers separated from the lowers?

c) How about a compliant detachable AR with the compliant parts attached, but with all the ingredients to make it into an evil "assault weapon" lying next to it? What if the evil parts are stored in the attic?

d) A detachable mag lower and an evil feature upper or stock, with no compliant parts in sight, separated, but stored next to each other? How about stored separately? What if a set of compliant parts are also stored with it?

#32 Gary_Hungerford

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Posted October 07 2016 - 07:17 AM

You keep saying "fire code is effective" yeah so? - I'll say it again - it has been discussed here, and it seems NYC has a 250 pound limit (I"m not positive, just what I recall...) the accused had LESS than that, so a non-issue.

Please name a receiver that by itself is an "assault weapon" ??

I'm also not arguing whether or not he had magazines or other violations of the law...

And you obviously missed the sarcasm in my "Standby Mode" comment.... (If you had been at the legislature to fight the proposed law, you'd get the joke...)


No, Peter, i never miss your sarcasm.
Gary

#33 zzrguy

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Posted October 07 2016 - 08:44 AM

So was it a AR or was he building a AK. The gun store I've been in will not sell a AR to a city resident cause from my understanding they are banned in NYC for years as well as AKs. So if that is correct how did he buy a receiver to have parts for a unassembled assault weapon.



One last thing where the hell do you keep 45,000 rounds of ammo in a one bedroom in queens. Glad that place disn't burn.

#34 ProGodProGunProLife

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Posted October 07 2016 - 08:52 AM

So was it a AR or was he building a AK. The gun store I've been in will not sell a AR to a city resident cause from my understanding they are banned in NYC for years as well as AKs. So if that is correct how did he buy a receiver to have parts for a unassembled assault weapon.



One last thing where the hell do you keep 45,000 rounds of ammo in a one bedroom in queens. Glad that place disn't burn.


Good question. 80% receivers? It could also be that he had disassembled NYC legal guns, like say a Ruger 10/22, and had evil stocks, barrels, grips, etc.

From what I understand, ammo does not pose nearly as much of a fire risk as people might think.

#35 Gary_Hungerford

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Posted October 07 2016 - 08:59 AM

So was it a AR or was he building a AK. The gun store I've been in will not sell a AR to a city resident cause from my understanding they are banned in NYC for years as well as AKs. So if that is correct how did he buy a receiver to have parts for a unassembled assault weapon.



One last thing where the hell do you keep 45,000 rounds of ammo in a one bedroom in queens. Glad that place disn't burn.


Whatever "AW" parts or "AWs" he allegedly had, we will never know. 45K rounds of ammo really doesn't take up much space, especially if some of it is .22. A case of 5K rounds of .22 measures roughly 7.5x18x9 inches and weights only about 40 pounds. Cases of 5K rounds of centerfire ammo would be closer to 4~7 times that aggregate volume, depending on which handgun or rifle caliber(s) are involved. Still, not a lot of room. That could be stacked, in a closet, without too much effort.
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#36 Gary_Hungerford

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Posted October 07 2016 - 09:00 AM

Good question. 80% receivers? It could also be that he had disassembled NYC legal guns, like say a Ruger 10/22, and had evil stocks, barrels, grips, etc.

From what I understand, ammo does not pose nearly as much of a fire risk as people might think.


Agreed. Ammo tends to go "poof," in the heat of a fire, as the heads melt, not explode.
Gary

#37 mrprovy

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Posted October 07 2016 - 10:38 AM

He was a reloader, the article said 45K of bullets which does not take up much space at all

#38 ProGodProGunProLife

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Posted October 07 2016 - 11:05 AM

He was a reloader, the article said 45K of bullets which does not take up much space at all


You mean he manufactured his own, special, extra high powered, extra deadly ammunition! Thank goodness he was captured! /sarcasm
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#39 Rightsholder

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Posted October 07 2016 - 01:02 PM

I don't care about the rifles and pistols especially since he seemed licensed. I guess he had some rifles or rifle parts like receivers that are illegal in NYC?
But honestly, if I were living in an appartment building or multi family dwelling I really don't want a neighbor stashing or playing with 225 (or even 100) lbs of gunpowder. In event of a fire somewhere in the building that stash can cause a lot of unnecessary harm to neighbors and firefighters alike.

The problem with these kinds of people are that they are a bit over the top and the liberal media and politicians use them as their poster boys for new legislation.

#40 Rightsholder

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Posted October 07 2016 - 01:06 PM

You keep saying "fire code is effective" yeah so? - I'll say it again - it has been discussed here, and it seems NYC has a 250 pound limit (I"m not positive, just what I recall...) the accused had LESS than that, so a non-issue.

Please name a receiver that by itself is an "assault weapon" ??

I'm also not arguing whether or not he had magazines or other violations of the law...

And you obviously missed the sarcasm in my "Standby Mode" comment.... (If you had been at the legislature to fight the proposed law, you'd get the joke...)

In NYC owning a standalone lower receiver for an AR could be deemed illegal, especially if you did not get a permit / registration for it as a long rifle which permits I don't think that they are giving away these days...
anyone know if NYC gives registration permits for any AR platform these days (even the thordson or DSI types)?

We are all guessing and he took a plea it seems so its hard to tell what the facts are. He might have been bullied and had poor counsel so he took it.





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