Freeport and cameras... - Print Topic

To state further, as a Freeport R&R member, that's not the only reason for the additional cameras. Yes, there have been cameras before the new additions. There have been some people shooting Shotguns, Magnums, .223's, and have begun to destroy the new range by shooting, mid range, ceilings, vents, (anything other than targets). The attempt is now to seek out these perpetrators and punish them for their violations---which could cause the loss of their memberships and licenses. People who have been trained and shown the regulations for Range use, and deliberately abuse the range. These rules are not just for harassment (stupid observation)but for safety and preservation of a great range facility, which morons insist on doing their "thing." Further NON-Members are NOT PERMITTED to shoot unless a Range Officer is present, due to insurance regulations. I will be willing to talk with anyone (sanely) about the range and our "stupid" regulations---just e-mail me and I will contact you so you and I can talk. As of now no more real dumb objections without knowing the complete facts. :damn "Doc"

@Ten Ring: As a member of the Freeport R&R I welcome the cameras. How long is the retention period for the images and who has the right to review such images? As with any security measure, I know that it can be a double edged sword. I welcome the usage of cameras to keep the idiots from destroying the range that I enjoy using but I am also mindful that the video could be compiled into a defacto gun registry by the wrong parties. What safeguards are in place to prevent this?

Quoted from gmirsky

...the video could be compiled into a defacto gun registry by the wrong parties.

They're already on your license. You already have a registry with the worst parties.

Quoted from cas

They're already on your license. You already have a registry with the worst parties.

Only handguns... Long arms are not.

Quoted from ten ring

Further NON-Members are NOT PERMITTED to shoot unless a Range Officer is present, due to insurance regulations.

I thought non-members were not permitted to shoot at the range... period.

I was thinking of joining, but hesitant because I enjoy shooting with friends (and not all would be willing to join). This might be good news for me if confirmed.

El Guapo Defeating Evil is a copy right material. I am talking to my lawyer from my home village "Santo Poco":

btw, he is also the doctor.

I'm also a Freeport member and can respect the right of the club to protect the property, otherwise we all lose. As far as the tapes go and how long they are kept, I don't know but at the same time we are not talking about our good friend Mr. Bloomberg here and I for one am not concerned a compilation would be put together for anyother use but as intended.
As far as non-members shotting, yeah I wish you could bring a friend to shoot and hopefully join the club, but at the same time I know there is no way I would have met some REALLY nice people with matches at freeport and the pine barrons. I think ElGuapo and his Doctor would also agree.

When I was there for the safety thing the other day, it was pointed out just how much the ceiling is hit, which is quite often. Seeing as you're always shooting at 25 yards, somebody is doing something very dangerous to get the bullet strikes that were evident, and if the cameras help stop it, then I'm for it. There was a guy next to me that was unsafe in a variety of ways and he was instructed as such. Having a pistol permit just means you're not a felon, it doesn't mean you have any idea how to handle that killing machine in your hand. If I see that guy there when I go, I'm going in the other direction.

The sad fact is people come in with a 'rental' mentality.... "It ain't mine, so who cares if it gets messed up" Not realizing that their membership is more of a 'partnership'.

Zero respect for the property, the rules, and other members when someone feels they don't have to follow the rules about NOT shooting centerifre rifles in a range designed for rimfire & pistol calibers.... "So what if the bullet goes through the wall?"

I keep hearing about the lights & vents getting shot up - and I've always wondered how many times it's PD with the girlfriend....(before anyone jumps on me, I've seen it at other places, and it gets SCARY!)

I'm always against big brother 'observing' needlessly, but there was/is a need here.

the Pine Barrens lost the steel at 600yd (or was it the 600yd line altogether?) because of the few who can't respect the rules...

Quoted from xdguy

I'm also a Freeport member and can respect the right of the club to protect the property, otherwise we all lose. As far as the tapes go and how long they are kept, I don't know but at the same time we are not talking about our good friend Mr. Bloomberg here and I for one am not concerned a compilation would be put together for anyother use but as intended.
As far as non-members shotting, yeah I wish you could bring a friend to shoot and hopefully join the club, but at the same time I know there is no way I would have met some REALLY nice people with matches at freeport and the pine barrons. I think ElGuapo and his Doctor would also agree.

My doctor is in a trance at the moment and I dare not to speak for him, but I agree with the statement of meeting good folks at the matches. If we could only get Mike to stop cursing ... oh wait my doctor is out of his trance ... I think he is saying... "keep dreaming..."

I for one think that for the money one should be allowed to bring friends with him as long as all are following the regulations and rules set forth by the establishment.

I also dont like the mob mentality that if you hit something and damage club property you can lose your pistol license - who are you to have such powers, I can only hope that there would need to be clear and obvious proof that such direct and intent destruction had taken place before the ever mighty hand revoked your hard earned and expensive pistol permit..... Im friends with the people there and will always tip my hat to them but that rule is gray water to me, I hope that someone who cant shoot or is new to the sport doesnt hit a wall or ceiling isnt reamed.....I dont think any intentional destruction of the property should be taken lightly (including shooting restricted calibers) and I would help pursue any said individual but the revoking of your pistol permit is not something a range should have the power to do, period - I will never agree with that.

- I think making the said member pay for all repairs and being terminated is proper.

I also want to know who has access to these films and length of time they are stored, for $175 per year I don't think I should be treated like a felon.

clean the bathrooms they smell like piss, get some toilet paper and soap (not orange glow cleaner) and make sure the orange glow cleaner is in stock - I hate showing up and the cleaner is empty, toilets broke, no tp, no soap but yet dues go up

anyhow im there at least weekly and in the late evenings when my wife / kids allow and I enjoy the range with some members here, its a pretty great place to unwind in

It will always be the few who ruin it for the masses.

If anyone remembers, there used to be a place on Jericho named Island Guns in Huntington, and they had a range in the basement.

Neighbors would complain that they heard shots fired outside at all hours, and the shop would deny it. Until one day a responding Officer happened to notice bullet holes.... in the parking lot lights...

There will always be one. Try not to sit next to them.

Quoted from ten ring

I will be willing to talk with anyone (sanely) about the range and our "stupid" regulations---just e-mail me and I will contact you so you and I can talk. As of now no more real dumb objections without knowing the complete facts. :damn "Doc"

LIF is still freedom of speech right?[color=blue][/color]

Is this Alan? Also you might wanna put up a sign that there are cameras... I think its kinda against the law to video tape people with-out them knowing, I would not of known they were there unless my target keep falling and I had to walk down and pick it up... on the way back I saw these white cameras...

Sig, From what I understand they will write you a ticket (freeport police) for menecing with a firearm and that would cause you to lose your lic. More of using freeport PD to write summons to cause a loss of permit.

To play devils advocate. If I can go with you to shoot, why should I join? I'll just go with you every time.

It's a tiny range and I can see guests causing a problem at the wrong time.
It's an easy club to join and even easier to quit.

Quoted from cas

To play devils advocate. If I can go with you to shoot, why should I join? I'll just go with you every time.

It's a tiny range and I can see guests causing a problem at the wrong time.
It's an easy club to join and even easier to quit.

So how will the cameras know if there a guest shooting there? Someone going to be watching them all the time? checking book to cameras? Face reconition software? What upsets me is the fact there was no notice about this... they just showed up... too bad a Nice tv did not just show up... clean chairs.....

Now I play by the books while there, the only thing I do sometimes is take my jacket off in the range and my id is on it and not on me... Now is that due cause for a loss of a permit? Membership?

How are they going to id these members? Why not have a range officer do random checks... I never seen a R/O in freeport...

Also whats worse is that Freeport PBA keeps the door open sometimes at nite... That really pisses me off...

Quoted from noarguy

So how will the cameras know if there a guest shooting there? Someone going to be watching them all the time? checking book to cameras? Face reconition software? What upsets me is the fact there was no notice about this... they just showed up... too bad a Nice tv did not just show up... clean chairs.....

Now I play by the books while there, the only thing I do sometimes is take my jacket off in the range and my id is on it and not on me... Now is that due cause for a loss of a permit? Membership?

How are they going to id these members? Why not have a range officer do random checks... I never seen a R/O in freeport...

Also whats worse is that Freeport PBA keeps the door open sometimes at nite... That really pisses me off...

that gate is always swinging at night - just waiting for some meth heads from across the road to come and play......

my Id stays in my pocket and if its in my bag or jacket - deal with it.

Quoted from noarguy

LIF is still freedom of speech right?[color=blue][/color]

Sig, From what I understand they will write you a ticket (freeport police) for menecing with a firearm and that would cause you to lose your lic. More of using freeport PD to write summons to cause a loss of permit.

like I said before, if its intentional they should pay for repairs and be kicked out, if its accidental than perhaps some classes are in order - I can only imagine some of the shooters having issues being accurate at 50 yards on their first couple of trips, I am more concerned with the individuals where a honest mistake is made not vandals, its my range to shoot at and I dont want to shoot next to a idiot and risk getting shot or have a filthy range - thats why I pay

Quoted from cas

To play devils advocate. If I can go with you to shoot, why should I join? I'll just go with you every time.

It's a tiny range and I can see guests causing a problem at the wrong time.
It's an easy club to join and even easier to quit.

I know what you mean,

I have 2 friends of mine who are members at LIPSA. Good times. They each invited me ONCE to shoot with them. I tell you that in each of those visits to lipsa I had a ball. It's been a couple of years now, but I am still hopefull for the follow up invite. :P

TWICE... Es La Verda

^ :blahblah

I was going to invite you today actually, but I decided with the mild temps I would pass.

I was also going to Brookhaven today to see about getting some days... :sink that didn't happen either.

El Guapo, you can come with me to LIPSA as my guest. You can park the burro at the gate.

(actually they told us not to bring him anymore. shhh... :quiet )

A few months ago Ten Ring gave me a tour of the range. During the tour he happened to point out some of the damage that has been done to the range. I'm no marksman but there is no way that much of this damage was done by someone actually aiming at a target. It seem to be not simply a matter of carelessness but recklessness. It's a shame that there are those few that seems to have no regard for the partnership that the members share in taking care of the range.

As far as the cameras---the information is retained until a weekly review takes place or saved if they are looking for a range cowboy (no insult to CASS). The range is solely Owned & operated by the Freeport Police Benevolent Association, and they are the ultimate controllers of all that takes place. Yes, it would be nice for a friend to be able to come and shoot, ask me I will try to arrange a Range Officer to be there at that time. One must read the By-Laws of the Freeport R& R Club Inc. to be familiar with their rules & regulations. That is the main substance of our safety classes. The classes are taught by one volunteer and a LEO from the FPD, PO Richard Samuels; who is a young and very personable individual ( not a grouchy US & THEM type.) As far as the legality to tape and review---go argue with the Penal Code of the state of New York. You are being taped at every turn of your head when you step out of your house and this one thing bites you in the donkey. Them's the rules and we members of the Freeport R&R, the Little Club and the Junior club are quite satisfied that our facilities don't become part of the maniacal "Range Wars" held each day at the wonderful turbulent, explosive, County Range which are fought daily by many ( not all ) out-of-control gun owners. We love our range and bathe in the facts of the thousands of dollars and many hours of time ( by volunteers) that were recently spent to upgrade the inside and outside facilities. Thanks to the Freeport PD for finding the funds to help restore our 20th Century Indoor facilites to the 21st Century.If you think the regulations are "tough" at Freeport try the Roslyn R&R Club at 2X the cost. They have cameras and summarily kick people out and have licenses suspended or taken away for violations. The cameras at Roslyn Indoor and Outdoor exceeds 12 at both facilities. We the members ove Freeport, take great umbrage at some of the idiots who DELIBERATELY use their guns to destroy the place. These are the same village idiots who shoot at Posted, Road and No Trespassing signs upstate, they are not welcome at Freeport----STAY AWAY WE DON'T WANT YOU. :damn ""Doc"

Sounds much safer than the places I currently get muzzles in my face at. A range needs order and safety above all.

I find it hard to concentrate when I have a 16 year old kid next to me popping off rounds out of his dads 1911....at 100 yard target?

(While dad is sipping Jagermiester?)

I wish I had my camera that day....

Quoted from ten ring

As far as the cameras---the information is retained until a weekly review takes place or saved if they are looking for a range cowboy (no insult to CASS). The range is solely Owned & operated by the Freeport Police Benevolent Association, and they are the ultimate controllers of all that takes place. Yes, it would be nice for a friend to be able to come and shoot, ask me I will try to arrange a Range Officer to be there at that time. One must read the By-Laws of the Freeport R& R Club Inc. to be familiar with their rules & regulations. That is the main substance of our safety classes. The classes are taught by one volunteer and a LEO from the FPD, PO Richard Samuels; who is a young and very personable individual ( not a grouchy US & THEM type.) As far as the legality to tape and review---go argue with the Penal Code of the state of New York. You are being taped at every turn of your head when you step out of your house and this one thing bites you in the donkey. Them's the rules and we members of the Freeport R&R, the Little Club and the Junior club are quite satisfied that our facilities don't become part of the maniacal "Range Wars" held each day at the wonderful turbulent, explosive, County Range which are fought daily by many ( not all ) out-of-control gun owners. We love our range and bathe in the facts of the thousands of dollars and many hours of time ( by volunteers) that were recently spent to upgrade the inside and outside facilities. Thanks to the Freeport PD for finding the funds to help restore our 20th Century Indoor facilites to the 21st Century.If you think the regulations are "tough" at Freeport try the Roslyn R&R Club at 2X the cost. They have cameras and summarily kick people out and have licenses suspended or taken away for violations. The cameras at Roslyn Indoor and Outdoor exceeds 12 at both facilities. We the members ove Freeport, take great umbrage at some of the idiots who DELIBERATELY use their guns to destroy the place. These are the same village idiots who shoot at Posted, Road and No Trespassing signs upstate, they are not welcome at Freeport----STAY AWAY WE DON'T WANT YOU. :damn ""Doc"

the volunteer hours there is tremendous Richie, Alan and the others who work hard and try harder to make Freeport a pleasant experience have their hands full.

The people who intentfully shoot our range up need to go and soon, and I think if members where more involved maybe there would be a greater sense of comraderie and less members who are careless by thinking "if I paid I should have X,Y,and Z"

I still think the restrooms need some more attention, id be willing to chip in if I knew where things where (mop, spray, etc)

Quoted from noarguy

I was at freeport last nite, New addition to the indoor range is cameras....

I dont know if thats good or bad... But yup something new.... too bad we could not get a update else where...

Actually, the cameras have been there for over three years.

AJC

Quoted from iNCNF

Actually, the cameras have been there for over three years.

AJC

I think this is Alan right? Whats up with the new lights inside? It seems a bit darker in the indoor range? Also Would I get in trouble for leaving the door open to let some warm air in the range before I start shooting? It must of been like 30 degrees last week...

I agree with Sig, I think freeports great, and I know alot of things happen site unseen but I would love to be apart of repairing this range....

I wish there was a Meeting where member could go to two or three times a year to give suggestions....

Quite frankly, I don't understand this whole thread. I joined Freeport in October 2009, at the same safety meeting that Noarguy and Sig joined. It was made very clear about the rules:
ALWAYS wear your ID - Sig posts he keeps it in his pocket, just deal with it.
We were told cameras are always recording - Noarguy seem shocked and offended about cameras.
No guests are allowed to shoot unless a R.O. is there or it's an open match - guys want to pay one price and bring all their friends for free!
Space heaters are above each indoor point - Noarguy is cold.

Then I went back to October posts, and see Sig and Noarguy were the two who got there late and missed the orientation. Perhaps they should have been told come back in November, on time, and if happy join. If not happy with the range, thanks anyway for stopping in, have a nice day!

I'm all for wanting to get involved and improve conditions, but we are all adults. Either follow the rules and stop complaining, or don't join and be happy elsewhere!

Hope this post doesn't offend anyone and get deleted!

Quoted from BBJ

Quite frankly, I don't understand this whole thread. I joined Freeport in October 2009, at the same safety meeting that Noarguy and Sig joined. It was made very clear about the rules:
ALWAYS wear your ID - Sig posts he keeps it in his pocket, just deal with it.
We were told cameras are always recording - Noarguy seem shocked and offended about cameras.
No guests are allowed to shoot unless a R.O. is there or it's an open match - guys want to pay one price and bring all their friends for free!
Space heaters are above each indoor point - Noarguy is cold.

Then I went back to October posts, and see Sig and Noarguy were the two who got there late and missed the orientation. Perhaps they should have been told come back in November, on time, and if happy join. If not happy with the range, thanks anyway for stopping in, have a nice day!

I'm all for wanting to get involved and improve conditions, but we are all adults. Either follow the rules and stop complaining, or don't join and be happy elsewhere!

Hope this post doesn't offend anyone and get deleted!

1) I joined before then, and not only was on time but the first person there and then met reodds, who was the second person there, we beat Alan by 10 minutes or so, but I guess that was posted there as well.....

2) I wear my id around my neck to and from the range after I sign in I put the id in my pocket for security reasons and don't need my name out to people who I do not know.

3) I have a rented room or two at Mitchell Field, twice a month, where I bring all my friends and shoot free with sufficient insurance coverage, I said I would like to bring a friend or two on occasion to come with me, the once in a month or two at midnight, who have yet to join or have not been able to make a class - most of my friends have joined Freeport already, at my advice, and we share very similar feelings.

4) I have no issues with the space heaters although its cold for a while until they kick in - the AC however can be felt in other states

5) I have no issues and wish more cameras were all over the place to record the activities taking place that are damaging our range.

I think you should be informed prior to writing some random post in which you think you know all and have the answer to everything.

I think if paying to join a range it should be maintained, my issue was with the restrooms being clean and having a anti bacterial soap available, I have spoken to Allan about this and I agree with him that even if its cleaned 5 times a day, someone will still soil the bathroom - the soap used to be on the wall until someone ripped it off, I actually bought soap for the rooms and plan on putting them there on my next visit. My other issue was the gate being left open and making a secure range open to vandals, criminals, and drug addicts from across the road (if you payed any attention in the orientation in which you where on time for) you would know across the street is a drug rehab = not to mention the location is kind of remote and very commercial making me always watch my back walking to and from my vehicle.

And if you read back just a few posts, not months, you would notice I also mentioned appreciating the possibility to volunteer my time when I come to clean the RESTROOMS so it can be CLEAN.

and no offense taken by your previous post.

I don't know what you look like, so I don't know what time you got there, but this was your post, not mine, from October:

"I came in around midway (tan cargo pants / tan boots) when Richie was speaking to everyone outside at the 50 yard mark - prior to moving to the outdoor range point, the other guy who I can with (black hair) was Noarguy"

So your saying I made that up?

All I'm saying is I don't understand this thread. Everything was made perfectly clear before joining, there were no secrets! Everyone had the opportunity to tour the bathrooms, range, parking lot..you name it. If not happy, don't join, that's all!

Glad you're not offended, neither am I!

Quoted from BBJ

I don't know what you look like, so I don't know what time you got there, but this was your post, not mine, from October:

"I came in around midway (tan cargo pants / tan boots) when Richie was speaking to everyone outside at the 50 yard mark - prior to moving to the outdoor range point, the other guy who I can with (black hair) was Noarguy"

So your saying I made that up?

All I'm saying is I don't understand this thread. Everything was made perfectly clear before joining, there were no secrets! Everyone had the opportunity to tour the bathrooms, range, parking lot..you name it. If not happy, don't join, that's all!

Glad you're not offended, neither am I!

that was me coming to a safety meeting after I joined to welcome fellow LIF'ers on my free time and introduce them to Allan and be available to help in any way possible - your not making that up nor reading incorrectly, just interpreting it wrong.

I understand about the thread as well - but to me its just a rant / vent thread and where else to vent then here on LIF, although I do think there is a comment and suggestion box in the club house by the pay phone under the deer head, could be wrong.

When I toured it was nice and clean, after a long day when I go to shoot 12:00-3:00am or later it can be dirty, my rant is I would like clean bathrooms - and the means to clean them myself so it can be clean for others, perhaps some spray or mop and bucket, I dont mind getting my (gloved) hands dirty for a more pleasant experience, plus Freeport is the only bathroom I have without 3 screaming kids lol so its in MY best interest to keep it comfortable.

I know we're all just ranting, and I wasn't trying to get into a pissing contest with anyone, but I happen to believe that for the money, Freeport R&R is a pretty decent place. Also, none of the rules are that difficult to follow! If an outsider reads this thread, one would think the place was a rat hole, which it's not.

It just bothered me to read these complaints on a public forum like this.

And believe me, I know what you mean about having a clean bathroom all to yourself once in a while!

Quoted from BBJ

If an outsider reads this thread, one would think the place was a rat hole, which it's not.

Freeport is a great place and worth your time and money, the people are great, the volunteers are great, and the outdoor range in the summer is priceless - dont take me wrong

OK NOW THAT WERE HOPEFULLY ALL DONE RANTING WHEN WE GOING TO DO SOME SHOOTING

I've had the pleasure of visiting both Freeport (thanks Ten Ring) and Old Bethpage (thanks Gary H.). Unfortunately I heard the same sad story during those visits regarding the lack of regard some members have for the facilities. Hence cameras were installed at both ranges in an attempt to stem the tide of destruction. It's unfortunately but is seems some adults don't believe in the shared responsibility the club members have in maintaining the facilities. The cameras are there to help weed out those that aren't self-disciplined enough to act like responsible adults.

Quoted from 2edgesword

I've had the pleasure of visiting both Freeport (thanks Ten Ring) and Old Bethpage (thanks Gary H.). Unfortunately I heard the same sad story during those visits regarding the lack of regard some members have for the facilities. Hence cameras were installed at both ranges in an attempt to stem the tide of destruction. It's unfortunately but is seems some adults don't believe in the shared responsibility the club members have in maintaining the facilities. The cameras are there to help weed out those that aren't self-disciplined enough to act like responsible adults.

Well said!!!

Yup. If you go to just about any range, you'll be able to hear stories that sound just like this: We used to be able to do this or that, 'till some dumb donkey..." :B

Mind your own business Torre!!! >:( :P

Oops. One tequila too many... deleting the previous thread... :blondmoment

Quoted from bobtorre

Jefes, with $15 you can shoot rifle, pistol, shotgun, skeet, trap, 7 - 200 yards. at Brookhaven and you can bring a friend along. For about the same price you can do the same at Carvelton and you can shoot 50 bmg and if you care to shoot that beast. No membership is required, imagine that. Unless you are retired or unemployed and have a lot of time in your hand I don't know what value a membership in any private club can bring to you.

But...the real questuion is....do they have bathrooms at Calverton? :-/

:flush

Quoted from Tonto

But...the real questuion is....do they have bathrooms at Calverton? :-/

:flush

they have port o potty - you will not come out the same, I still twitch on the right hand side sometimes......

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D :'( ;D ;D

Quoted Text

they have port o potty - you will not come out the same, I still twitch on the right hand side sometimes......

Quoted from sigsauerny

they have port o potty - you will not come out the same, I still twitch on the right hand side sometimes......

:gaffaw2

Quoted from bobtorre

Oops. One tequila too many... deleting the previous thread... :blondmoment

Hehehe.... enough of your posts get deleted without you doing it too!! ;D

Quoted from bobtorre

Oops. One tequila too many... deleting the previous thread... :blondmoment

I love it! This site is so PC that people are now deleting their own posts! ;D ;D ;D

PC .... Don't mess with the architect :whistle

"Quoted from bobtorre
Jefes, with $15 you can shoot rifle, pistol, shotgun, skeet, trap, 7 - 200 yards. at Brookhaven and you can bring a friend along. For about the same price you can do the same at Carvelton and you can shoot 50 bmg and if you care to shoot that beast. No membership is required, imagine that. Unless you are retired or unemployed and have a lot of time in your hand I don't know what value a membership in any private club can bring to you."

One of major benefits for me is knowing that the individual to the right, left and behind me has been given some basic firearms safety training. The club members have to be recommended by an existing member and they are screened. It's not foolproof but it at least gives you some idea of the disposition of the individuals that are members of the club.

A second benefit is having the range available 24/7 365 days of the year so you can getting your shooting in around your schedule. As for me Old Bethpage its 10 minutes from my house and my place of employment. Another bonus is the opportunity to meet and befriend other individuals that are 2nd amendment and shooting sports advocates. If you shoot on a regular basis the membership cost rivals or is a better deal then going to a public range so I see many benefits to becoming a member of a good, reputable club.

Cameras
The knife cuts both ways. I have seen the damage from "shooters" that 1- have aimed for the "teco strips" that hold the back stop lumber together. 2- Some of the damage inside (shooting out electrical boxes and the like). While limited damage by a "AD or just a bad shot" is a fact of life at any range, when you have someone aiming at the lumber that IS THE RANGE ITSELF or stapling targets to the support structure one has to wonder what’s in the mind of the shooter.
That said I am a fairly new member and don’t speak for Freeport R&R, the range is the Freeport Police range that’s shared and I’d like to think the guys I shoot with are a much higher caliber than average, care about the range and the club and also have some pride in seeing that the range is a well kept, safe, and fun place to shoot. (No reflection of other clubs I’ve shot at. You guys know I love you out east, and I know your hard work and pride in your club is deserved).
In this age of the "Anti Gun NY state of mind" we all have to think of image, insurance, and general CYA. In a 24hr. range, trust is prime, till the trust is broken and, well afterwards, one sees the need to do the CYA thing. Sad, yes, but one can understand.

PS. Can I come out east with El Guapo to play?

Hey, the way I feel (which means nothing since I do not use the range there) is that if people are damaging the range, on purpose, by all means put up cameras.

On a side note, any man who is willing to put on latex gloves and scrub a bathroom that is not his, deserves respect. If I owned that range, he would get free membership....

Quoted from 2edgesword

"Quoted from bobtorre
Jefes, with $15 you can shoot rifle, pistol, shotgun, skeet, trap, 7 - 200 yards. at Brookhaven and you can bring a friend along. For about the same price you can do the same at Carvelton and you can shoot 50 bmg and if you care to shoot that beast. No membership is required, imagine that. Unless you are retired or unemployed and have a lot of time in your hand I don't know what value a membership in any private club can bring to you."

One of major benefits for me is knowing that the individual to the right, left and behind me has been given some basic firearms safety training. The club members have to be recommended by an existing member and they are screened. It's not foolproof but it at least gives you some idea of the disposition of the individuals that are members of the club.

A second benefit is having the range available 24/7 365 days of the year so you can getting your shooting in around your schedule. As for me Old Bethpage its 10 minutes from my house and my place of employment. Another bonus is the opportunity to meet and befriend other individuals that are 2nd amendment and shooting sports advocates. If you shoot on a regular basis the membership cost rivals or is a better deal then going to a public range so I see many benefits to becoming a member of a good, reputable club.

Jefe, don't get me wrong I am all for supporting all local clubs. It is because of them that yours truly can battle Evil and the reason I help as much as I can before and after every match. This is the reason why I deleted my original post. I was afraid people would take things out of context ... and it happened. My original point is that if you have a full workload, family and wife to attend to the benefits of club membership maybe few. And that perhaps club would be best served by members who do have the time not only to enjoy the facilities, but participate and volunteer in activities the club wishes to engage into. Fellow shooters and supporters of the 2nd are found in all the ranges... otherwise why would they be there. Safe and unSafe shooters are found everywhere even after taking a safety class; trust me. I don't know of any recent incident in any of our ranges where a fellow shooter was accidently shot by another. What are the stats to support your fear for safety in these public ranges? I have met the most friendly and easy to get along people in public ranges. Also the ability to introduce new shooters to the sport without restrictions on the number you can bring at a time at public ranges is a big plus. In some, you even have good cleaned bathroom facilities like in Brookhaven and lisc. I think this is key if the sport is to survived us here in the Island (yes new shooters and clean bathrooms :) ) Note, I am not just talking about the young ones but adults who have an interest but have no idea how to start.

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