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DOs and DON'Ts of Safe Buying

8K views 23 replies 12 participants last post by  Lee442 
#1 ·
DO purchase a safe that is bigger than you think you need.
Your gun collection is bound to grow over time. A good safe is more than just a gun locker--it becomes a secure storage device for your family's other valuables as well. You'll find you quickly fill up even a large safe. Spend the money for the size, protection, and features you want. Your gun collection may be worth many tens of thousands of dollars. Some people who visit this site wouldn't hesistate to spend $1100 for a custom action or $1400 for a NightForce scope, yet they don't want to spend more than a few hundred dollars on a safe. That's not common sense. If you're on a tight budget, consider a used safe. Unlike many other products, safes don't really wear out over time. When businesses change locations, you can get a very high quality commercial safe for little more than the cost of removing it.

DO spend more for a safe that offers fire-resistance.
But you have to do your homework--you can spend a lot of money for "fire-proofing" that actually is not very effective. Make sure if sheet-rock is used that it is properly installed. If you have valuable documents and media files, it's not a bad idea to purchase a smaller, commercial-grade fire safe to put inside the gun safe. This gives you double protection.

DO look at many different brands of safes before you buy.
There ARE significant differences among brands. For example, Browning offers a unique (patent-pending) door-mounted rifle rack. Zanotti offers slide-out drawers and a modular design that is much easier for an owner to move. Ft. Knox uses an advanced method to secure and stabilize its fire-proofing layers within the safe. Brown offers custom exotic wood interior shelving and safes with commercial-grade burglary protection (much thicker steel with heavy composite doors and walls). Amsec offers a proprietary "DryLight" poured concrete-type fire insulation with greater structural strength than typical sheet-rock panels.

DO investigate the safe's specifications.
Just because a safe is big and heavy doesn't mean it's particularly secure. Heavy-gauge steel is much more resistant to cutting and drilling than light 12- or 14-gauge steel. Some safes on the market have walls so thin they can be penetrated with a fire ax. We recommend 10-gauge steel at a minimum, and 8 gauge is much better. The safe should carry a UL RSC (Underwriters Laboratories "Residential Security Container") or better rating.

DO ask about the safe's safeguards against tampering.
A quality safe will feature extra armor or devices to defeat drilling. Low-grade safes can be opened in a few minutes with simple, battery-powered hand tools. All safes should have relockers to help ensure the safe remains locked in the case of a burglary. Relockers are hardened pins that are triggered during an attack, and cannot be retracted without hours of drilling. The number of relockers on a safe ranges from 2-10+ depending on the safe's size and burglary grade.

DON'T store powder in your safe. A tightly-sealed metal box with a large quantity of powder inside is a bomb. Store powder in a separate, lightly-constructed cabinet or wood box. The main thing for powder is to keep it dry and away from moisture and light.

DON'T store large quantities of primers in your safe. If one primer goes off it can detonate others, causing a chain reaction. If you have many thousands of primers, don't store them all in one corner of your reloading area.

DON'T leave the wooden pallet on your safe and rely on the safe's mass alone to deter thieves. A 10-year-old kid with a rented pallet jack can move a 1000-pound safe with ease if the pallet is attached and the safe is not bolted down.

DON'T locate your safe in plain view, such as the front of your garage, or corner of your living room. This is just an invitation to theft. And be discrete when you load and unload firearms--so you don't advertise to the whole neighborhood that you have a large gun collection.

DON'T leave power tools or cutting torches near your safe.
 
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#2 ·
Safe Installation Tips

Every safe, when possible, should be anchored in place with heavy-duty fasteners. Ideally, use multiple bolts in the bottom of the safe, anchored to concrete or solid foundation. Choose the appropriate lag bolts or anchors for the material below your safe. If you can't mount to the floor, bolt the safe to wall studs. You can locate the position of the studs with an inexpensive electronic "Stud Sensor" available at home supply stores.

If the steel on the bottom of your safe is fairly thin, place a steel backing strip between the bolt heads and the safe bottom. (Large washers will work, but a backing strip is better.) Without such reinforcement, the bolt heads may pull right through thin-gauge steel if the safe is rocked, or levered from the bottom with a pry-bar.

Locate your safe in the corner of a room or in a recess that blocks access to one or more sides of the safe. On many gun safes, the steel on the top, sides, and rear is thinner than on the door. Blocking access to the sides makes it much more difficult to use power tools on the sides, where the safe is most vulnerable. It's also wise to place the safe in a relatively tight space with limited room to manuever. Anything that makes the safe harder to move helps deter would-be thieves.

Many people place their safe in a garage or basement. That's not necessarily a bad idea, but people also tend to store their tools in the same locations. Don't store your power tools next to the safe. One safe-maker told us how a customer's safe was defeated using the owners' own cutting torch which was stored right next to the safe!

Inspect the area around the safe. Avoid locations where there are a lot of wood beams, paint cans, or other combustible material nearby. In the event of a serious house-fire, these items will fuel the flames, increasing the likelihood that items inside your safe will be heat-damaged.



Thanks to http://www.6mmbr.com/gunsafes.html for this writeup.
 
#3 ·
Architect I hear you. When the ATF came a calling(when I got my license) this was their MAJOR concern Where are the guns kept,is it secure, and out of public view was also a consideration. This last time around (renewal) the local LEOs just wanted to reinspect to make sure everything was according to Hoyle Again the concern was the security factor, and this time they looked at the door of the room to make sure it can be locked when no one is home (vacation or extended absences). Brothers if you have stuff with which Old Lady Mccarthy might get wrapped about,may  I respectfully suggest that you consider strong security precautions. I shudder to think that God forbid some one breaks into your house, and  they steal that AK47 you own. On this one I'm with the Architect 110% Right now everything is peaceful. As the Architect stated think about the security of that expensive stuff you own, and let me also add think about the security of  the controversial stuff as well. Let's not open that hornets nest again if we don't have to
 
#5 ·
Lemming said:
I'm a bit surprised by the "out of sight", as I've often seen the caution that a safe that is out of sight means that the safe-cracker gets to work unobserved.
They mean out of site from a person running through your house looking for a quick score. Hiding a safe in a closet is a great idea.

My "professional" opinion is get a good quality AMSEC floor safe and install it in a concrete floor. I have never seen one ripped out of concrete in all my years in the safe business. A common place is in the middle of a garage floor with a car parked over it. Who would ever think to look there? (now you will)

Another good location is in a closet under a staircase. It's a rough install, but also hard to deal with for the bad guys.

All the security in the world is just buying time. A professional will have no issue separating you from your stuff no matter how hard you try to protect it. The point is to keep the professionals from targeting you house.

Don't forget to read this sticky:

http://longislandfirearms.com/forum/m-1259119921/
 
#7 ·
milspecnsn said:
So what options are open to an apartment dweller?
rent space in mine?

;D
 
#8 ·
You could consider a smaller free standing safe and hide it back in a closet. A wall safe that is made to fit between the studs may not be a bad idea. A small Sheetrock patch when you move and all evidence is gone.

Another cool concept would be a piece of furniture made into a safe. They make fullsize beds as well as end tables and steamer trunks.

I actually fixed a safe that was built into an old fridge. Never would have even noticed it.
 
#11 ·
There are many factors in securing your stuff from fire and theft. Fire is simple.....you need to go with ratings. Theft is a whole different ballgame. The line of defense is:
- Keep your mouth shut (don't be telling others what you own)
- Get a dog
- Get an alarm system
- Get a safe for your valuables
- HIDE the safe (what can't be seen can't be stolen)
- Think about a "secret room" to hide that safe of yours
- Always remember, the master bedroom is the FIRST place a burglar hits. Flipping your mattress is what he'll do.

You need to set up barriers when trying to defend against theft.

While I won't retire in 12 or so years, I'm already working with my brother in law (who is an architect and builder) on designing my retirement home complete with a "hidden room".
My buddy has a small hidden room in his finished basement and it's the coolest thing.
 
#12 ·
You left one thing off your list...Insurance....Now matter what theft deterrents you have given the right oppertunity anything anywhere anytime can be stolen...That said,even if you get robbed once your stuff is gone its gone...Remember...guns,jewelry,camera equipment,antiques,rare coins and musical instruments are covered for BUPKUS on any homeowners or renters policy unless they are INDIVIDUALLY scheduled...Every pistol and long gun you own along with purchase documentation,serial numbers and or photos must be sent to your broker/agent and listed individually in order to get paid.One 1911 pistol stolen from your safe will max out your policy unless specified otherwise...and cash is never covered for more than $1000 so try not to keep cash in a safe
 
#15 ·
Pate said:
You could consider a smaller free standing safe and hide it back in a closet. A wall safe that is made to fit between the studs may not be a bad idea. A small Sheetrock patch when you move and all evidence is gone.

Another cool concept would be a piece of furniture made into a safe. They make fullsize beds as well as end tables and steamer trunks.

I actually fixed a safe that was built into an old fridge. Never would have even noticed it.
How much weight are we talkin' about for an adequate "smaller free standing safe"and how much of a hassle gettinf it moved when I move out? (stairs involved).
 
#16 ·
milspecnsn said:
There's also insurance available through NRA. the amount of "free" member coverage is being upped now from $1,000 to $2,500. I don't personally know how good the coverage is in reality. Any one have any info on this?
Gary's price killed the NRA insurance rate. Plus he's a member, so I'd still pay him more to keep the business local.
 
#17 ·
milspecnsn said:
How much weight are we talkin' about for an adequate "smaller free standing safe"and how much of a hassle gettinf it moved when I move out? (stairs involved).
The weight depends on the size and the class of the safe. Also remember that the door on good safes lift of the hinges and the door normally weighs as much as the body. Much easier to move two lighter things twice. :)

http://www.amsecusa.com/Burglary_and_Fire/

http://gardall.com/area-safes-type-fire.htm?PHPSESSID=09edcc9e9400177cb06f50eebd201062
 
#18 ·
All good info and I understand to buy bigger then you think.  I have a small safe for three hand guns but, want one that can hold a dozen plus a couple thousand rounds of ammo.  I do not plan on long guns and most safes I see cater to that market.  Anyone have any recommendations?
 
#22 ·
A newbie here but a bit of advice from my arsenal of knowledge. If you're going to put a safe on the main level or second floor, you might want to consider adding some bracing to the structure in the area it is in. Being that if your house catches fire the static load can cause a partial or full collapse of the floor.
 
#24 ·
Pate said:
Another cool concept would be a piece of furniture made into a safe. They make fullsize beds as well as end tables and steamer trunks.
Pate, you mean something like this? It is a bit large and looks expensive.

 
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