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Get the latest facts on the new NY SAFE gun laws that effect you!

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No discharge but no ranges?


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12 replies to this topic

#1 cprstn54

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Posted May 18 2017 - 07:43 AM

Huntington has a "no discharge" ordinance but no 50-200 yd ranges for mil caliber rifle, and the Zoning Board has allowed so much sprawl that there is probably no suitable places left for a decent range, except maybe the industrial area at the Smithtown border (i.e. town dump).

 

We have to travel an hour to Brookhaven to practice.

 

Anyone else see this as an infringement on a constitutional right? After all, if you can't practice frequently, you can't be safe and effective.

 

It's not that I want to shoot 30-06 in my back yard, but if we have a constitutional right, can the town effectively infringe it by inaction and neglect?

 

Ken C

 



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#2 Mad Russian

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Posted May 18 2017 - 07:59 AM

The Constitution doesn't say anything about a right to practice...

#3 pequa1

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Posted May 18 2017 - 08:07 AM

C'mon Ken, you live in Newyawkistan !    The libs can do anything they want.


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#4 sickofny

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Posted May 18 2017 - 08:37 AM

Unless your too young to remember it Huntington use to have a range on Spagnoli road west of Rt 110.  The range was closed on a trumped up charge of some woman sunbathing in her yard getting hit in the leg with a .22 bullet.  If you saw a picture of the bullet in question it looked like one that would have been kicked back to your feet from an indoor range.  In reality it should have been a pristine one that would have been fired from a perfect 45 degree angle in order to reach her and even that is a stretch.  Developers and ultra libs had it in for the range there for decades and kept pushing to have it closed and finally won back in the 90's.



#5 Destro

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Posted May 18 2017 - 10:12 AM

Townships, Inc. Villages, etc. have their own ordinances that supersede other laws...zoning, building code, offsets, discharge ordinances, noise ordinances, etc.,,,in my town bamboo is not allowed for instance.

 

 

Now the TOH no discharge also applies to anything defined as a "firearm" which in most LI towns includes; bow, airgun, bb gun and even slingshots (can't shoot a slingshot in your backyard). Some towns like my Smithtown, does have exception if you have enough property (which fortunately I do, and can bowhunt and shoot airguns in my yard). However no one shoots guns and how the ordinance exception does not apply to this has never fully been explained by anyone I know. Now during duck hunting season I swear some of the estates by the Nissy do sneak in skeet or trap in their yards...hearing shotguns is normal then. Upstate we plink on our property all the time and even built a range...nothing like mag dumps and multiple acquisition target shooing (so much more "real world" training that a formal range IMO).

 

In any case the availability of a range is not a constitutional issue in any way, thought it is an inconvenience for many to have to drive an hour to a range (though that's less than most people's work commute times around here) More of a gun culture (lack thereof) / downstate political climate vs. zoning and cost of operation (insurance, zoned property, etc) thing.


Edited by Destro, May 18 2017 - 10:13 AM.

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#6 cprstn54

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Posted May 18 2017 - 10:30 AM

The Constitution doesn't say anything about a right to practice...

I am trying to make  a case that the two are inseparably interconnected. The Constitution doesn't say anything about cartridges but I think it would be unconstitutional to prohibit cartridges and only allow matchlocks.

 

Ken C



#7 Mad Russian

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Posted May 18 2017 - 11:20 AM

I am trying to make  a case that the two are inseparably interconnected. The Constitution doesn't say anything about cartridges but I think it would be unconstitutional to prohibit cartridges and only allow matchlocks.
 
Ken C

You are correct, the Constitution doesn't mention cartridges, just arms. There may be a precedent: http://www.chicagotr...0118-story.html

However, since there ARE ranges on Long Island and just because they are inconvenient for you doesn't make a good argument in a court case.

#8 grifhunter

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Posted May 18 2017 - 12:15 PM

Suing for the right to convenient access to a range should IMHO be a little lower down on the list from  suing for rights to carry, suing for right to standard magazines, suing for 20 day handgun license issuance, suing for a proper grip on your semi auto rifle, etc.


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#9 ProGodProGunProLife

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Posted May 18 2017 - 12:26 PM

The subject of how zoning laws can impact constitutional rights, in general, is an interesting one.  I'm not sure how compelling of a case could be made that not having a range in relatively small town infringes on 2nd Amendment rights, when there are several ranges within a relatively short distance.  

 

If the town was specifically banning shooting ranges, even when those ranges would be extremely safe and would not create any other nuisance, such as noise, there might be a case.  


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#10 cprstn54

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Posted May 18 2017 - 01:31 PM

Townships, Inc. Villages, etc. have their own ordinances that supersede other laws...zoning, building code, offsets, discharge ordinances, noise ordinances, etc.,,,in my town bamboo is not allowed for instance.

 

 

Now the TOH no discharge also applies to anything defined as a "firearm" which in most LI towns includes; bow, airgun, bb gun and even slingshots (can't shoot a slingshot in your backyard). Some towns like my Smithtown, does have exception if you have enough property (which fortunately I do, and can bowhunt and shoot airguns in my yard). However no one shoots guns and how the ordinance exception does not apply to this has never fully been explained by anyone I know. Now during duck hunting season I swear some of the estates by the Nissy do sneak in skeet or trap in their yards...hearing shotguns is normal then. Upstate we plink on our property all the time and even built a range...nothing like mag dumps and multiple acquisition target shooing (so much more "real world" training that a formal range IMO).

 

In any case the availability of a range is not a constitutional issue in any way, thought it is an inconvenience for many to have to drive an hour to a range (though that's less than most people's work commute times around here) More of a gun culture (lack thereof) / downstate political climate vs. zoning and cost of operation (insurance, zoned property, etc) thing.

 

I have seen waterfowl hunting with shotguns & dogs on the tide flat just northwest of Kings Park Bluff. I was wondering if that is OK, could I practice archery against the bluff along Sunken Meadow Creek (or whatever it is called near the bluff)?

 

Sounds like it might be a grey area.

 

Do these town "no discharge" ordinances apply on the state parks and national parks within the town? There are places in Target Rock Preserve (federal) where archery could be safe.

 

Ken C


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#11 Destro

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Posted May 18 2017 - 02:45 PM

I have seen waterfowl hunting with shotguns & dogs on the tide flat just northwest of Kings Park Bluff. I was wondering if that is OK, could I practice archery against the bluff along Sunken Meadow Creek (or whatever it is called near the bluff)?

 

Sounds like it might be a grey area.

 

Do these town "no discharge" ordinances apply on the state parks and national parks within the town? There are places in Target Rock Preserve (federal) where archery could be safe.

 

Ken C

 

Parks are regulated by state or federal rules (reason you can't hunt in some).That is not private property.

 

Hunting is legal per DEC rules over all of LI, you can see people shooting shotgun over the water right next to other peoples houses, etc. You could practice archery on private property within a town that allows it if you meet the DEC exemption (if they go by that as TOS does for instance.).

 

So you have to understand that there are many laws of the land in play, you have a 2A right, but not one to hunt. Hunting has been always heavily regulated per DEC and state (with limits, permits, seasons, etc.) It is not a right like the 2A.. Public land and private property have different issues, and there are Federal, state and local laws that apply (just as there are to gun laws and even building or health codes).


Edited by Destro, May 18 2017 - 02:47 PM.

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#12 Phoenix69

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Posted May 18 2017 - 03:34 PM

THEY DONT CARE ABOUT US.


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#13 zzrguy

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Posted May 19 2017 - 10:11 AM

You have a better argument of taxation without representation than a constitutional argument. Municipalities, towns, and counties own golf courses, baseball fields, soccer fields, running tracks, tennis courts, bicycle trails, some even have equestrian centers, swimming pools, and a freaking Cricket field.


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